On Wed, Sep 16, 2009 at 08:59:35PM +0100, Cian Brennan wrote:
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> On Wed, Sep 16, 2009 at 12:24:44PM -0500, Marco Peereboom wrote:
> > On Wed, Sep 16, 2009 at 05:47:08PM +0100, - Tethys wrote:
> > > On Wed, Sep 16, 2009 at 5:37 PM, Henning Brauer <lists-openbsd@bsws.de>
> > > wrote:
> > > 
> > > >> Sounds like building from source is necessary to me.
> > > >
> > > > boo hoo. run one machine somewhere and make release. done.
> > > 
> > > And that attitude is why OpenBSD will never be more than a hobby OS. Sigh.
> > 
> > Correction, a professional OS that requires its users to be
> > professionals.  Not a bunch of whining windows update people that have
> > to call "IT" to launch excel.  In case you hadn't noticed we are old
> > school UNIX users that don't mind fixing whatever problem is at hand.
> > Including writing code or fixing a bug.  This is why in the olden days
> > your IT department was worth something and wasn't a bunch of monkeys
> > reading a script.
> > 
> > It is exactly your attitude that has ruined the computer industry.
> > 
> > 
> 
> You have an odd definition of professional, and the kind of attitude that
> sounds like you haven't actually worked in the computer industry in a while.
> Generally, the computer industry is about providing services to end users. And
> things like easy updates, specialisation of labour and all of that kind of
> stuff have made us an awful lot better at taht than 'old school UNIX' ever was.

No my friend.  The computer industry is here to save money.  Your
description is about having the industry as a means to itself.

Thanks again for playing.

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> 
> But hey, if you want to pretend we all still live in the early 90s, feel free.
> I hope it works out well for you. 

Works fine.  Too bad there are all those youtubers and twatters on the
net.  It was a much nicer place without them.

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> 
> OpenBSD's a wonderful OS, but it's lack of easy upgradability is a
> *disadvantage, not something to be proud of. And yes, there are good
> reasons why it doesn't exist, the linuxes do have massively more
> man power, and developers time *is* probably better spent on new features,
> rather than on packaging. Acting smug about your failings just makes you look
> like silly, however.

I update all my openbsd machines in less than 10 minutes including boot
time.  That is less time than it takes to download a linux kernel.  Not
sure what this upgradeability you are talking about.

I patched in my years of openbsd use twice from source.  Once for ssh
and once for bind.

I have no clue what you are on about.  It is all perceived ease.  Your
argument has no practical merit.